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Poster:
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Jim F |
Date:
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July 24, 2010 03:16:40am |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: For you 1968 Freaks |
The big thing for me is finding out that these were actually 4 track soundboards. I always thought they were made with mics onstage. Apparently what we have is kinda similar to 9/2/68, an early matrix of sorts with a HEAVY aud emphasis.
I would be most curious to hear more info about the 4 track reels. I'm guessing that 2 of the tracks were probably a stereo mix from a sbd recording feed, and the other 2 tracks were mics onstage, or very nearby, for added ambiance? I'm guessing Eaton's Dats were the direct mixdowns from the 4 track? Lots of questions to be asked...
I've personally always been really interested in all of those DAT copies of the master reels/cassettes, 90% of which always seem to have Eaton's name attached. I never like asking too many questions about who has done the transfers of the masters, usually if it's a cassette I assume it was Dick, but the same could go for DATs as well. Anyway I gotta run, asking too many questions anyway...more comments later
This post was modified by Jim F on 2010-07-24 10:16:26
This post was modified by Jim F on 2010-07-24 10:16:40
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Poster:
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light into ashes |
Date:
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July 24, 2010 09:06:08am |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: For you 1968 Freaks |
I see these shows are TJI now....(though ironically, one already can't be displayed...)
I've also wondered about Rob Eaton & how he got the run of the Vault. Friend of Latvala's?
It's interesting that the Dead wanted to do 'matrix' recordings this early.....perhaps they felt the straight SBD's weren't cutting it as far as getting the live sound down. Seems to have been a short-lived experiment...since these were at the Carousel, both Bear & Healy would've been there.
It would be nice to hear more details about the mixing, the mic setup for these '68 recordings... We won't get it from Miller though, he's very closemouthed about his sources. "4-track" is about as much detail as he ever gives.
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Poster:
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Jim F |
Date:
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July 25, 2010 12:12:56am |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: For you 1968 Freaks |
Personally I feel that these recordings should be listed as AUD's, partly because of the way they sound, but also for other reasons...
Anyway, I was alluding to Eaton earlier. Among all of us freaks there are so many names that get tossed around with great reverence: Miller, Latvala, Lemiuex, Walker, Cantor, Menke, Moore, Bertrando, Hohlwein, etc. (apologies to the many others instrumental in getting these tapes out). But Eaton is rarely among them. I find this somewhat ironic as his name is attached to just about everything that comes out nowdays. So many of Charlie Miller's transfers have "thanks to Rob Eaton for lending me his dats" in there somewhere. We know so much about the transfers of his tapes when they get into people like Charlie's hands, but next to nothing about how Eaton copied the masters, when, what equipment was used, etc. It's pretty well known that he was a taper back in the day and of course his involvement with DSO, but he seems to be a bit of a "man behind the curtain." The Latvala connection seems pretty obvious, esp as there are things like Charlie's comments in the 3/31 notes about "going with Dick's notes on DAT" regarding the date and such. He also thanks Eaton for lending him the dats on that one. I imagine for whatever reason Dick must have been feeding Eaton DATS on a regular basis, and one can only speculate on Dick's personal stash of tapes and what became of them when he died. But I guess we don't really need to know. It's probably best that people like Charlie keep pretty closemouthed about such things.
Anyway, these Carousel 68 tapes...yeah, I would love to know more about the masters, the mic setup, etc., but either way I don't care if we ever know as it's great to see fresh, crisp, professional transfers of these shows. 3/30 has long been a favorite of mine since obtaining it sometime in the 90's. The Dark Star, while still primitive, is a real gem, and as noted, is the longest known yet. The Other One sequence is great as well, but my favorite piece of the show is probably the Chinacat>Eleven. I think this was the first time I ever heard the pairing. I love any Eleven, and these earliest of versions are just as powerful as any of the latter versions.
I've had the 29th for some time as well, but it never got much play around here for some reason. While I know the show from the 30th like the back of my hand, I have little to no memory of the playing on the 29th. These new transfers, along with the previous post about the New Potato, gives me good reason to revisit the performance.
The 31st is such a short excerpt, but it makes for good filler when burning up any other early 68 show. I've always been a bit puzzled by the piece of Caution that we have, it clearly sounds like the end of the version on Anthem, but the quality on the album is different than found on the raw tapes. When looking for 68 tapes, Caution has always been the one that grabbed my attention when seeing it on a list, it is always unfortunate when you find out that it's very short or is missing a big chunk (which seems to happen quite a bit with Caution's, as they usually came late in the show and always seemed to have an unfortunate cut/reel flip during some crucial transition into the beginning of the song or conversely into feedback or something). It is a shame that the show is so chopped up and partial, I imagine we are probably missing a really great Alligator>Caution or Eleven>Caution. Maybe it's on some missing reel that wound up on the cutting room floor when the album was made and will turn up someday. HIGHLY unlikely, but us 67/68 freaks will never give up hope on these sorts of things.
At any rate, any and all music from 1968 has been, is, and always will be special treasures in my collection that we are very lucky to have. Had it not been for their crazy aspirations for the Anthem album, we might not have any of these Carousel shows. God bless Dan Healy. And Charlie Miller as well, for being so generous enough to share these nice sounding transfers of some classic era GD.
This post was modified by Jim F on 2010-07-25 07:03:29
This post was modified by Jim F on 2010-07-25 07:12:56
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Poster:
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light into ashes |
Date:
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July 26, 2010 01:45:18am |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: For you 1968 Freaks |
You know, I agree with you now... It fit so perfectly into the missing gap of 1/22, and it even came from the Miller source, but the evidence is against that date! Quite the goose-chase on my part.
One thing I noticed on checking it again, the mix changes in Caution - the drums become much more up-front at about 3:30 into Caution, a sure sign of a matrix mix. And as it happens, the Dancing in the Streets from 3/31 also has a huge mix change - the 'audience' sound disappears when they go into the solo, and it becomes a straight SBD. (For that matter, it was like that on the older 3/30 source too, but I hadn't noted it.)
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